Nick Varner - Part 4 (From World Championships to "White Lightning")

Speaking of nine ball, we're still back in 1999. Not only did you win the World Bank Pool Championship, you won a second WPA World Nine Ball Championship at the ripe old age of 51.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Back in those days, they said nobody could play nine ball. It was a young man's game.
You had to have young eyes. But I flew from Reno to Alicante, Spain. Oh, and I think I flew.
Must have been a Monday and you lose a day going to Europe. So when you get there, it's Tuesday. My first match was on Wednesday at nine or 10 AM.
See, I was spoiled in those days. I made my living mostly when the sun went down.
And playing pool at nine AM in a lot of the world tournaments, when you travel to other countries, for some reason, they like to start early and they like to be done early at night.
And I won that 86 World Tournament, probably five AM, when I made the winning ball, which turned out not to be too good for straight pool, but because of the bad scheduling, that was the last time ABC Wide World of Sports had a straight pool
tournament, televised that curative. And I flew over there, and for some reason, I just started going to bed early.
I'd go to bed at nine or 10 at night, and sleep and get up at six AM, and my schedule until the last day or two, I played almost a morning match every time, and I was rested, and for some reason, and I was actually sharing a room with Jeremy Jones,
and he was kind of a night owl. He was going, there was a nightclub right, or we were right on the ocean, and there was a nightclub right on the bay there, and it was popular in the Spanish people. They're night owls.
I'd get up at six AM, there might be 50 cabs there picking up people to go home at six AM. I mean, act. But I fell into that, and Jeremy come in later and stuff, and didn't bother me.
And I got the full night's rest, and then I had one close match. That was one of those matches where I kind of run away with it too. The Japanese player, I'll never forget, he had a shot on the seven.
You just wouldn't expect him missing. I mean, it's missable. I mean, you know, that's one thing doing teaching with Mark.
I found out that there's hardly anything you can't miss. And from all my years of competing, you, you know, everybody makes this statement, said, I never miss that shot. And then you just missed something out of the clear blue.
I remember I had a student one time and he's a pretty good player and he missed a absolute hanger. And he said, I never miss that shot. I said, what are you talking about?
I just saw you miss that. But anyway, that, that tournament, I fell into a real good frame in the second match. I think it was the second or third match.
But anyway, I played a Japanese player and he had me, he had me, it was Hill Hill and he had three balls on the table. And he did have to cut the seven a little bit and he just cut it a little too much. And I won that match.
And I think that was a Hill match too. But after that, that tournament, the races were the 13 and nobody else turned nine. And some of them, like the defending champion, I had him 11 to 0.
So I really played phenomenal in that tournament. And then the finals was a little bit of a funny match. Everybody thought Jeremy was like a huge favorite over me.
And because he's a lot younger and stuff and, and, but anyway, it was a weird match. The guy didn't wreck the balls. They had a racquer for us and he did a pretty poor job.
And you could see that the one wasn't really touching him. And he was doing his best, but he just didn't have a clue.
And Jeremy mentioned it during the match, but I was, you know, anything that brought me to the game more, I figured made me the, had I had a better chance to win.
You know, somebody runs four or five racks on you, it's tough to win, but if you have to fight it out rack for rack, you know, I didn't mind the way the guy was racking the balls.
And it was a weird dissent I think I ever played because you could hardly ever run out.
And I bet five or six games I won on ridiculous combinations where I just figured shooting a combination, I had a better chance shooting at the combination and missing it than I did trying to play a safe because there was just no place to hide.
And I made every one of them. And I mean, they were like every one of them was probably like two and ten shot that you make one or two times. I mean, it was ridiculous.
And so I won that match. And I'll never forget, I never made that many combinations.
Well, you still got another world title in you. And this is in 2000, you win the World One Pocket Championship.
Yeah, that was another game that was something else. It was in Portland, Oregon, and the races were to four. And I went undefeated 7-0, so I won 28 games.
When you add all my opponents' games together, they won four games, and I won 28. I won 28 out of 32 games. And I really caught a good gear there.
And I remember playing Alex, so the hot seat. And that was pure double elimination that tournament. And I beat him 4-1.
And he was shooting so straight back in. I mean, he still plays great, but, and I beat him 4-1. Then he went over and played Perican, and he come back and played me in the finals, and I beat him four zips.
So beat that guy. Try to somebody beat that guy eight out of nine times at the end of the tournament. Good luck.
What do you think, Mark?
Oh yeah, he's one of the all-time greats for sure. He's right up there with you. Very complete player, plays all games.
And that's what I always admired about you is everything I wanted to be. Someone that can play any game, top speed.
You just don't see that very, normally there's specialists and you don't see them be diverse enough to play straight pool and then switch in the bank pool and then go to eight ball and then, all the world championships.
Nick won five disciplines, out of his eight world championships. So remarkable. There's no one that can compare with that in the United States.
Well, as you said, Nick, there's only so many hours in the day, right?
So where would you have time to learn to play three cushion or play snooker or some other game?
Well, I had pretty good. I had my hands full trying to make a living playing nine ball. I mean, it's not like we're playing for astronomical purses.
And the guys I played weren't suckers. I mean, you know, almost all of them top eight players are 10. They all Hall of Famers.
I mean, pretty well speaks for itself.
Yeah. Yeah.
I used to make the joke. You almost had to be a Hall of Famer to survive. Financially.
Yeah.
Yeah. So early in the 2000s, as you're winning some of your final tournaments, describe what the pro game was like. Was there a tour?
Were there many tournaments every year for you guys?
Well, Camel kind of the pro tour when Camel walked away, when they came in, they kind of took over the pro tour. They were running the tour, and then when they decided to leave, there was nothing left.
So what was the timing then? When did they, when did?
That was two, the last year Camel was with the pro tour was 99, they came on board in 96.
Okay, all right.
And then when they left, they took over the whole tour and there wasn't hardly anything left.
It was really, probably the darkest time in Pool was, 2000 to, you know, really, it's really just picked up in I'd say in the last two or three years where it looks like it has a future. You know what I mean? What do you think Mark?
Well, I agree.
Yeah, there was a vacuum left when Camel left because Camel was the greatest pro tour we ever had. And then, you know, when they left, we didn't have anyone to pick up the pieces and there was ill will and bad feelings.
And so consequently, here we are in 2025, and we have three tournaments a year. And one of them is more of a festival, the Derby. It's a great fun event, but it's not all pros.
Where the International Open and US Open, those are elite pros. Otherwise, you have to go overseas to play the top tier competition.
Yeah, that's what I'd like to see. But everybody always wants to get to the promised land. They want to start off in the promised land.
Nobody wants to build anything, you know, with pool. They want somebody to drop a big bag of money. But I still think if they started out and had the goal would be to get 10 tournaments.
I mean, the pool room owner could put up two or 30,000. You can get money from, I think, I think that's very feasible to have 10,000 added tournaments. And I think it would grow from there.
I think if those tournaments, if they could figure out how to make money at those tournaments, instead of people losing money running a tournament, if they could get enough sponsors where they made money, everybody would want to get in on the
bandwagon. Because I've talked to pros over the years. I said, you should hope these tournament promoters get filthy rich, because I said, if you do, there'll be plenty of people trying to climb on board. You know, and but that's a starting point.
And I think it'd be feasible for the industry to put together. I don't think that's too much money. And it would grow from there.
You know what I mean? And it would make our players more competitive. They could play, go to more standardized rules where they play.
When we played in the Moscone Cup, they all was trying to change the break. You know, they wanted to change a break every year, the box, the rail. And I mean, now they're whiffing the one and going like a zebra back and forth.
I mean, it's ridiculous really. And yet they still make the one every time in the side. You know, well, might as well be making the corner ball.
You know what I mean?
Right, yeah, yeah.
But Matchroom, they offer a lot of hope. The only thing is that worldwide tour, that's really expensive to fly around the world. And there's not that many of them.
And that's gonna be no bargain until the money gets up a lot higher. I mean, you have some guys that I've seen where, what's this, half the year's gone. Justin, or Joshua Fillers leading with 154,000 in prize money for the year.
And the next closest guy to him is like half that. And so it's got a long way to go.
But yeah, compare that to golf and tennis and some of the other sports. You can't compare, can you?
Well, you know, when I used to do the exhibitions, they were so big, I could go into Pittsburgh or Cleveland. And I could call the sports cast and get the guy out.
The main sportcaster, he'd come out, spend, they loved filming a couple of trick shots. And then they showed on the six and ten o'clock news. And they used to love that.
And I bet that's a lot harder to get it on today because those same people that are filming that trick shot, they just got done maybe talking to a mediocre shortstop that's making 5, 10 million a year.
Yeah. Yeah. So when Camel pulled out in 1999 or so, a lot of guys had to come up with Plan B.
What was Plan B for a lot of guys to make a living?
A lot of the older guys stepped away.
Yeah. A lot of the older guys did step away. And I started my business.
I was, let's see, 99. I've been 51. I mean, I was one of the world nine ball champion, but there wasn't much to play.
And when we lost that ranking system, that was a brutal blow.
That, I don't think a lot of people realize how important having a ranking system is where, you know, I know when I did my best endorsement deals, I was ranked number one because the guys behind me could try to knock me out of the box on the
endorsement deal and get it for themselves. My classic line was, you know, do you want the best player in the world working for you?
Because everybody else, they can scream and holler and say, they're better, but the bottom line is, they're standing behind me.
Yeah, yeah. So your plan B was develop a business.
Yeah, well, I knew my whole career that the twilight years might be a little brutal. I mean, I realized first place wasn't an appointed position. And I was always trying to figure what am I going to do?
And finally, through the companies I work for and the contacts I made over the years, I thought I could design my own cues and and eke out a live. And I started with in 99, I started with 28 pool cues and seven cases.
And it took me about a year to put that together, but I was traveling a lot. So so I did it while I was traveling.
And then I did about three months, I did a marketing survey where I checked to see how big that market was and the price point, because obviously I can't compete with the Walmart cues. And I didn't have the contacts. Miseric had that business.
He he had he got in all those contacts through his exposure with the commercial and TV exposure. And and actually, I guess he was playing in a pro pro am pro am on the PGA tour and met the guy that was chairman of the board of Kmart.
And that's what got him started. And he ended up selling cues by the train carload.
Tell us a little bit about your business then today.
Well, I started with a four page brochure. And I was still traveling a lot, either exhibitions or tournaments. I mean, even though things weren't too hot, like they were with Camel, there still was some tournaments out there.
And the prize money not have been the best, but that's where most of the good players went. And so I was able to build that business along the way.
Hand out a brochure, stop at a pool room, a retail store as I was driving, because I might drive to the East Coast, where I'd stop in the bigger cities and stuff. And I-95 is a dream for a salesman. I mean, that's where all the population is.
I mean, it didn't take me too long to figure out I needed to be anywhere from Fort LaMaine to Miami on that I-95, Philadelphia, New York, Baltimore, DC. And so I worked that area and I got some really lucky breaks.
To get started, the company, the table company I represented at the time, Peter Vitale, they- I still have the display. They built me a wood display that held exactly 28 cues.
And they put Nick Varner's Signature Series, really first class professional artwork. And they painted it on the wood and it was four poster. And they put me right in the middle of their booth.
They were a successful company with a lot of dealers. And so I originally planned on running the business out of my house. And the first trade show, I sold way too much to run it out of my house.
So I remember writing that check. I'd save some money, but not enough to maintain my lifestyle, that's for sure. And I remember writing that first check out for 60,000 for about 3,000 cues.
Man, I kept sitting in my living room and boy, I was having a hard time. Spilling that baby out. I'm just sitting there thinking, thinking, thinking, because there's so many things that could go wrong.
Number one, I knew I'd probably get a pretty good jumpstart, but then somebody has to pull them off the wall because I'm competing with all the big companies that are doing things first class.
They got great catalogs and great ads and they do everything just first class and their products are good.
But somehow people, I was able to get on that wall and people pulled my cues off the wall because if you don't get reorders, it's not a business. You don't have a business and I was lucky.
I just kept building it year after year and getting more dealers. Up until COVID, I probably traveled well over 200 days a year. Either playing in tournaments, exhibitions, clinics, and then COVID kind of changed it drastically.
The supply chain for delivery of my products got so long, it's hard to deal with. And now with the tariffs, you know, at one time, all my cue, well, they started out in Canada and then Taiwan, then I went to China.
And the tariff, I mean, when they went to 145 percent, all the boats had to turn back around to go to China. You know, nobody had that kind of margin.
And it's still almost impossible, I think, with the, I think the terms right now are 37 and a half percent, that's still, my margin average is on everything for the year, about 30%. So, but I built it the old fashioned way.
One, I walked in and because I won the world championship, my timing was pretty good. Because when I walked in, people were tickled to death. I walked in their front door, I was highly visible.
At the time, I mean, they were really happy that I walked in and they'd give me, usually the hardest thing was getting away. They wanted you to hang out in the store all day, then they want to take you to dinner. And I could only make one call a day.
Of course, today, I don't have that problem. I mean, they still might be happy I walk in the door, but my visibility is not quite that high. But anyway, it got me through the tough years, 50 to 75.
So, and now I'm in pretty decent health, so I go to work every day. So I just, it seems to be working for my health. And plus, everything I've done, I've covered almost all the bases in pool and I like every one of them.
Maybe my favorite thing besides playing is walking in a customer's front door. Because I kind of sold, I decided to do kind of the rapport selling.
I like to spend two or three hours there because then they have a choice of where to buy their products.
So if I can develop a rapport and they like me, I have a chance to get business because before I walked in their front door, they were getting all their cues some place else. You know what I mean? It's not like they have to buy from me.
And I was really worried about once they got on the wall because that you'd be out of business before you got in business if nobody bought it. But that market was pretty strong in the price range I was in at that time.
I think it was about retail about 60 to 150. So, it's not something where people like a Custom Cue, 500, 1,000, they got to hire. They maybe got to save up to get where mine.
If they see it, they like it. They can afford just to take it with them.
Yeah. So, as we look at the accolades and awards for one Nick Varner, this is unusual. It's almost like he wins an Oscar, an Emmy, a Tony.
You know, he's in all these Hall of Fames. 1992, he gets inducted to the BCA Hall of Fame. 2005, gets inducted into the One Pocket Hall of Fame.
2011, they put him in the Bank Pool Hall of Fame. Is there anybody else that's in those three Hall of Fames? Probably not, huh?
I don't know.
Maybe Jersey Red would be.
I don't know if there is or not. The banks in the One Pocket kind of go together, but where the BCA is, that's one thing. That is a pretty elite Hall of Fame, the BCA.
There's, it's getting in that one's a little bit difficult. And yeah, I would like to say a few more things. Number one, I'd like to thank all the friends that I've made over the years and all the helping hands that I've got every step of the way.
I met just some fantastic people. It's unbelievable when I think about all the friends.
I could, I can start traveling full time and I don't know how long it takes just to get around to see people I know and spend a couple of days and, and I know some time we like to think well, we did it ourself.
But just like I mentioned with Peter Vitale and my cue endorsements over the years. And I'm lucky that I've had so many friends and, and my dad and my, my family and then probably turn my greatest performance on the pro tour.
My wife and she's a pretty, I know I was listening to somebody the other day saying they could use a good coach, but it doesn't forge the luxury to bring on with you. But I could see how to be helpful.
And my wife, Tony, really served kind of, I mean, I don't think she missed over two matches in 15 years. I mean, she religiously was sitting in there. I used to think she's just bullshitting with the people.
She'd be bored out of her mind and stuff. But after the match, we get to talking about it. I couldn't believe, because I'm the world's worst.
If Mark comes up and sits down with me in the bleachers, I get to visiting with him. I forget what I'm watching. I don't even pay attention.
But Tony, and I remember her support and sure helped my performance. Well, the first tournament I went to, I'd be there from raising the finals in the Glass City Open. I drew him the first round and beat him.
He came all the way through the losers bracket. That was 1988. I beat him twice, beating the first round and the last round.
That was a pretty good omen. I sure got one lucky row when I met my wife, Tony.
Well, good. That's probably a terrific way to end this, but we don't let you go without answering three questions. I'm going to turn it over to my senior partner for question number one.
Okay, Nick, if you were 20 years old and had to do it all over again, what would you do different?
20 years old, do different.
Well, first thing to hit me, I work on my break. I thought I worked on my break shot, but I would work on it because one thing that hasn't changed in the game is if your opponent breaks better than you, you're not going to win.
And that hasn't changed a bit in the last 40 or 50 years. That's if you got out broke, you weren't going to win a match or a tournament. That's still just as true as it ever was.
And so I would work on that break shot more. And I think, well, I grew up when I would watch a lot more. I did watch a lot of matches, but the players today have a real luxury.
They can just get on YouTube and watch anybody in the world play as they can spend their entire life just watching matches. So that would have been a real blessing. That would have cut down the time to get, I think, to get to the top.
And so, like I won my first World Tournament, I was 32, and I think it was only the second World Tournament that I played in, in Stray Pool. And mostly because you couldn't afford to go to New York.
I think when I won the World Tournament, my first place was $5,000. And then you got to pay your expenses in New York City.
That's a little brutal. So the break shot, for sure.
Yeah. Yeah. That, and I'd like to, today, you got the luxury of watching all the great players.
I think you could really move up in the game a lot faster because back in my day, it was a luxury to watch the pros play. You know, you didn't get to see much.
Like I saw Jimmy Caris and, and Joe Balsas play a lot of exhibitions, but that's a little different than a tournament. And then I, I went to Johnson City a couple of times in the 60s. And then I played the last three years, they had the tournament.
And, and, but I had no idea when, I had no idea when I went to college that I would end up being a professional pool player. I had no, I was a pretty good student. And, and, and I, I figured that I'd end up doing something in business.
Yeah.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, let's, let's, let's do question number two. Question number two, I'm going to give you, and you'll, you'll appreciate this as a golfer. I'm going to give you one career mulligan, one shot to do over.
Where, where would it, where would you think of one shot to do over that might've made a difference? Where would it be?
One shot, let's see, a mulligan now. Well, you know, it might not be one shot, but you know, not too long ago, probably a year, year and a half ago, I watched a match, I lost to Efrem Reyes in the US Open.
And I'd like to, I wished I would have known then what I saw on that match because I got out broke. That's the main reason I lost. And, and I struggled with the break and I kept hitting them harder and harder.
And when I watched the film, I could see that I went the wrong way. I should have hit them easier. I should have taken probably 25% off the break.
And I bet the balls would have poured in. Because when I watched the match, I could see the balls that just like no ball was even trying to find a pocket. It was just like the pockets were closed.
And, and, and I kept going the wrong way. If I hit them easy, I'm liable to hit. I think I might have hit him with four or five racks.
But that's not one shot. If I think about one shot, one shot that always kills me to this day is I lost any second in the World Nine Ball Championship in 1990 in Las Vegas at the Sahara Hotel.
I think I had a one game lead, or it was about even, and it was about, I think, 6-6 or 7-6, or it might have been 7-7 even. It was close to the end. I hooked Earl Strickland and I thought I really had him.
It wasn't automatic that he hits the ball, let alone he hits the 7. The cue ball goes down and cuts the 9 in a foot out on the table. He didn't even know where the 9 was at on the table.
I mean, it's such a lucky kick shot and I end up losing that match at the end there. And that one always sticks in my mind. And I was playing Earl again, I was playing Earl in Bergheim, Germany.
It was a first world WPA World Championship in Bergheim, Germany. And it's a semifinals to go into the finals. And I had a long reach on a shot.
And I wish I would have got that bridge. And it wasn't a hanger. I mean, it was a pretty tough shot, but I'd like to have that one over instead of reaching for it.
It was, I'd like to try the bridge. So kind of a decision making. So those are a couple of examples.
Well, I like your first one because it's somebody else's shot.
And it reminds me of when we interviewed Jack Nicklaus and we asked these same three questions on our golf podcast. So we come around to the mulligan and you're expecting, okay, what shot did Jack hit that he'd want to do over?
He won 18 majors, finished second 19 times. You know what he did? He named three shots that other guys took to beat him.
I thought that was sort of interesting. So when you mentioned somebody else's shot against you, that's sort of interesting. So anyway, let's go on to our final question, Mark.
Nick, as far as your legacy goes, how would Nick Varner like to be remembered?
Yeah, I should have given that some thought.
That'd be good for your tombstone there, I guess. I guess something along the lines of never give up, but that would be one. I always tried as hard as I could to never lose my composure.
It was tough in spots, which the old saying is, when you're playing perfect and you run four or five racks, and you run over the guy and beat him 11-2. But the matches that are hard to win is when you're not playing so good.
And when you're playing with your big game and you still got to figure out a way to grind it out and win, when everything's going your way, the momentum, and you're just breaking and getting a good shot every time.
And that's sure a lot easier when you got to fight ball for ball or game for game.
Well, that really is Nick Varner, a grinder. Nobody worked harder on their game in my era, that period. And when you came to the tournament, he'd be practicing, and when he went to bed, when you went to bed, he was still practicing.
And same thing the next day, always had his head in the game, never gave up, never quit. And throughout this couple hours, you can see the passion this man has for the sport. And it's so compelling to me.
This is why I love doing clinics with Nick, because he likes the money, but he doesn't do it for the money. He does it because he actually loves pool and wants to give back and he shares with the other people there.
He doesn't just say, you know, I'm the best that ever lived and you people are nothing. There's never any attitude like that. So that really speaks to his character.
Yeah, Nick, we really appreciate you being on and sharing your story.
You know, we're just at the front end of this little project. But if I look over to our golf experience where Bruce and I have had the chance now to talk to one hundred and eight of the greatest golfers that ever lived.
Well, I hope in a few years, Allie and Mark and I are going to be able to look back and say the same thing. We talked to all these old greats.
Some of them, by the way, in five years may not be around anymore, but we got their stories on Legends of the Cue.
Let me add one thing and then you close it up, Nick. Nick Varner cues, get one before one gets you.
That's my slogan. And then the cue I play with still to this day, the white lightning, when I first started selling it, I said, you better, if you run into white lightning, you better realize a storm is coming your way.
And I named the cue white lightning. And so, yeah, when I looked back, I really been blessed. I mean, I'm not saying that it's been an easy ride, but it got a lot easier when I started performing better.
But still, you know, there's no pinching fun at the end of the rainbow and pool. You got to make your own. So I feel like I've really been lucky, and a lot of people have really helped me along the way.
And I really treasure those friendships. And I appreciate the help, because a lot of people think they're super smart and they did it all themselves. But I don't think so.
I think the people you surround yourself and become friends with, I think that's who you become.
Yeah. Well, thanks again for sharing your story on Legends of the Cue. We hope you enjoyed it.
Okay.
Thanks, guys. Thanks, Mike. Thanks, Mark.
It's been fun.
Thank you for listening to another episode of Legends of the Cue. If you like what you hear, wherever you listen to your podcasts, including Apple and Spotify, please follow, subscribe, and spread the word.
Give our podcast a five-star rating and share your thoughts. Visit our website and support our Pool History Project. Until our next golden break with more Legends of the Cue, so long everybody.